John Gormley

 70. Mr. Gormley asked the Minister for Transport the public transport operators that are ready to facilitate the introduction of integrated ticketing in the Dublin area; the reason for the delay in operationality in the outstanding carriers; and the expected timeframe for completion. [16283/06]
 
   Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): I propose to take Questions Nos. 70, 83 and 130 together.
  The Railway Procurement Agency, RPA, is the statutory body responsible for the delivery of a national multi-operator system of integrated public transport ticketing using smartcard technology.  The RPA is introducing the system on a phased basis in line with international experience in the Dublin area initially and with the involvement of public transport providers.  As part of the phased introduction of smartcard-based integrated ticketing, Morton’s Coaches, in conjunction with the RPA and as a proof of concept, successfully launched smartcards on its services in April 2004.
  Another step was taken in March 2005 with the launch of smartcards on Luas services.  The Luas smartcard deployment continues to help in obtaining important feedback from passengers and provide operational experience for the next stage of integrated ticketing.  More than 11,000 smartcards have been purchased to date for use on Luas services.  In addition, both Dublin Bus and Irish Rail continue to offer existing bus-rail ticketing arrangements.  Both companies are also developing plans to introduce smartcard technology and have been requested to pursue the matter on the standards and requirements of the RPA.  They also have tickets that integrate with Luas services.
  Following an inconclusive procurement procedure in 2005, the RPA, in consultation with the different State and private transport providers, in particular Dublin Bus, has presented proposals to my Department for a revised implementation plan and budget with associated timeframes.  These proposals and the amount spent to date are currently the subjects of examination in my Department.  I expect to reach decisions on the next steps in the matter in coming weeks with regard to the outcome of a peer review of the project, which has been requested by my Department.  This review is being undertaken in accordance with Department of Finance guidelines designed to ensure better value for money for public expenditure and ICT projects.
 
   Mr. Eamon Ryan: Would the Minister agree that it is remarkable that 12 years after the original Dublin transportation initiative report in May 1994 set out the clear recommendation to move towards integrated ticketing as soon as possible, we have no effective integrated ticketing?  Is this not a sign of remarkable failure on behalf of this Government and its responsibility after nine years in power?
  Would the Minister also agree that instead of following the recommendation to request other operators to provide assistance to the RPA in this matter, international experience shows that the only effective way to get proper integration is by effective regulation, wherein a body, be it the Dublin Transportation Office, RPA or Department, told the agencies that they must integrate?  Is it not the case that the blocking agencies in developing integrated ticketing have, to a large extent, been the public transport bodies in this city, be they Dublin Bus, Irish Rail or others?  I want the Minister to comment on this matter directly.  If he believes this is the case for whatever reason, such as commercial rivalry or the agencies’ fears about confidentiality, is it not incumbent on his Department to start taking real action and enforce the recommendation set out 12 years ago in the Dublin transportation initiative plan?  Why have we failed for 12 years?  Why is the Government still just requesting and not ordering proper integration?
 
   Mr. Cullen: The Deputy is right in that the full legal mandate for delivering integrated ticketing was given to the RPA.  It has made substantial progress in the introduction of a smartcard that operates on Luas services and a private sector coach company, Morton’s Coaches.  I have held numerous discussions with the other public transport operators in Dublin to try to bring about a resolution in this issue.  It has been very frustrating.  Some of the practices involved have been unacceptable.  I have asked that a peer review of the project be carried out under the Department of Finance’s guideline rules, which is currently taking place.  When it has been completed, I will decide on the next step.  That is the position at present.
 
(later)
 
   Mr. Eamon Ryan: The Minister is apportioning the blame for some of the delays on the public transport companies such as Dublin Bus.  In that context, how can the Minister state, in response to my question earlier, that the RPA had sufficient power under the regulations?  If it had such sufficient power, why did it not enforce such power with Dublin Bus if it did not co-operate?
  The Minister stated that some practices that went on were unacceptable.  Will he provide details of what he meant about how some of the operators related to this issue?  For clarification, is the peer review group of the project being carried out by the Department of Finance?  Was it requested by that Department?  What prompted it to carry out such a review and when will it be completed?
 
   Mr. Cullen: The Deputy may recall that the peer review group was established in the wake of the PPARS issue.  My Department, rather than the Department of Finance, asked for this review to be carried out.  We asked it to review the project to establish the current position.  I should have the results of that review within the next few weeks.  I hope it will provide a map of the way forward.
  I said in my reply that the Department brought in an external expert to consider the status of the project.  I saw a very interesting presentation as to its significance.  Having seen the external expert’s presentation, I believe that no one knew what they were talking about.  Everyone concentrated on one issue, namely, the card.  However, in terms of a fully operational integrated smart card system, some six or seven issues must be addressed.  As far as I can gather, only one issue was being addressed.  Significant fundamental issues about moneys, transfers and other governance issues were not addressed.  This brought certain concerns home to me in terms of going forward.  While I hope the review group will provide me with its views on the next step as far as the technology is concerned, carrying on as we are at present will not deliver the type of smart card technology or an integrated ticketing system that the public deserves.
 
   An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: I call Question No. 71.
 
   Ms Shortall: Will the Minister leave it with the RPA?
 
   Mr. Eamon Ryan: Did no one know what they were talking about?  If no one did, is it not the Minister’s job to sort it out?
 
   Mr. Cullen: I may have other options.
 
   An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: We should turn to Question No. 71.
 
   Mr. Eamon Ryan: No one knew what they were talking about.
 
   Mr. Cullen: Yes.  It is interesting.  Everyone focused on a single issue, namely, the card.
 
   Mr. Eamon Ryan: The Minister has spoken about pulling everything together.
 
   Mr. Cullen: I found out about this because I pulled everyone together.
 
   Mr. Eamon Ryan: Did no one know what they were talking about for 12 years?
 
   Mr. Cullen: I can only answer for the time when I had responsibility.  I seem continually to answer for what other people did in their time in other Departments and taking the blame for it.  However, I am dealing with this issue, even though it was not originally put together by me.

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