EU Summit
Mr. Gormley: The European Council meeting of 23-24 March this year was very important, discussing as it did the defining issue of our age, namely, energy consumption and the effect that can have on the way we live. I am referring to the concept of global warming. We need to reduce our carbon dioxide emissions by about 60% to 80%. We are currently 25% above 1990 levels, much higher than our Kyoto commitments. That will result in fines which industry probably will not pay, but which the taxpayer will have to foot. That is what we are facing. There is no free lunch when it comes to global warming. It is something we have to face up to.
The Minister believes that we can put our heads in the sand. He is backing people and has a sweetheart deal with CRH, as Deputy Quinn has said. These people are building inferior housing around this country. We are consuming vast amounts of fuel in transport, building more motorways and there are a million and a half more cars. That is unsustainable.
About 12 years ago, when I was Lord Mayor of Dublin, I ran my car on biodiesel. This was a source of great fun for many people in the media. Certainly I was the butt of many jokes, but times have changed and hopefully people have come to realise that this is an important sources of fuel and is sustainable. The Government has now introduced some grants at least for solar panels, woodchip burners etc., but the Minister is way to late. He needs to cop on and get moving on this.
Only Germany and Austria explicitly rejected nuclear power. This is very important. I have noticed at the convention on the future on Europe, when we signed motions opposing nuclear power, the Irish Government would not sign on, for whatever reason. I am starting to realise why this is. We have had declarations of intent from the Taoiseach, who was at pains to point out that this Government is opposed to nuclear power. He has said the EU’s work on energy will not, in any way, affect our national policy to reject nuclear power stations. I ask the Minister what the national policy is and where is it defined. The Minister professes to be opposed to nuclear power. He should read the Seventh Schedule of the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) Bill 2006, which refers to “a thermal power station or other combustion installation with a total energy output of 300 megawatts or more”. That is a nuclear power station and it is in the Seventh Schedule. What the Minister and the Government is doing is leaving the door open for nuclear power. I am quite sure my constituents would like to know that. Certainly, my colleague, Councillor Mark Deary, will be telling a great many people that this is a Government, to use the Taoiseach’s words, “backing two horses in a one horse race”.
The Minister is saying, on the one hand that the Government is opposed to nuclear power—–
Mr. Quinn: It is west Sellafield.
Mr. Gormley: This is it. It is opposed to Sellafield, but leaving the door open to fast-track nuclear power stations in this country. I should like answers on this because if the Government does not introduce an amendment to exclude nuclear power stations from the Seventh Schedule, clearly it is being hypocritical in the extreme. The Green Party will mount a campaign against this. We will use postcards and do everything we can. Will the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Dermot Ahern, who claims to be opposed to nuclear power introduce such an amendment to this piece of legislation? He owes it to the Irish people to do that, at the very least. He should tell the House that he will introduce such an amendment.
I also want to refer to the results of the declaration at the very end, where there was supposed to be some reference to Guantanamo. Despite demands by the Netherlands and Belgium the conclusions of the EU Summit in Brussels did not contain any reference to the US prison camp at Guantanamo Bay. However, the press statement explicitly backs closure of the camp. What was the Minister’s position on this? Did he back the call for reference to be made to Guantanamo Bay. This is, in my view, in breach of international law. Ireland has said, as a country, that it expects the highest regard for international law to be upheld and respect for human rights. Yet I do not know what the Minister’s position was in this matter.
I ask. in conclusion, that the Minister responds to those two aspects: his position now as regards the Seventh Schedule of the strategic infrastructure Bill, which allows the option of nuclear power stations to be pursued; and our position as regards Guantanamo Bay.
(later)
Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): I totally reject what Deputy Gormley said about the Government’s view on nuclear energy. We are absolutely against nuclear energy.
Mr. Gormley: Prove me wrong.
Mr. D. Ahern: We have made this point clear—–
Mr. Gormley: Bring in the amendment.
Mr. D. Ahern: —–despite what Deputy Gormley and his cohorts might try and say. I say it as it is in terms of the energy mix we have which will exclude the nuclear option as long as this Government is in office.
Mr. Gormley: Bring in the amendment then.
Mr. D. Ahern: It does mean then—–
Mr. Gormley: Will the Minister bring in the amendment?
Mr. D. Ahern: —–that we have a much more difficult issue in terms of the continuity of the security of supply—–
Mr. Gormley: I think we have the Minister’s measure now. We know where he is coming from.
Mr. D. Ahern: —–in regard to the type of fuel and energy mix we require. As Minister, I started the ball rolling in regard to the east-west interconnector. It was our view that this should be rapidly brought forward, and my successor in that office has done this.
Mr. Durkan: We are encouraging him.
Mr. D. Ahern: As Minister, I decided, in conjunction with our Northern colleagues, that we should have a second interconnector, as the first interconnector has not been blown up every second weekend.
Mr. Gormley: The Minister should exclude nuclear power from the infrastructure Bill. It is a simple as that.
Mr. D. Ahern: From the point of view of security of supply, I stand on my record as Minister with responsibility for energy.
Mr. Gormley: We have the Minister on this one.
Mr. D. Ahern: I do not know what the Deputy is prattling about. He is always prattling. Will he please excuse himself and have manners.
Mr. Gormley: It is called the truth.
Mr. D. Ahern: Have some manners.
Mr. Gormley: It is called the truth.
Mr. D. Ahern: I thought the Deputy was well brought up. He should have some manners.
(later)
Mr. Gormley: I confirm to the Minister and to you that I am well brought up. The prattle to which you referred is called the truth.
Acting Chairman (Dr. Cowley): I ask Deputies, including the Minister to address their remarks through the Chair.
Mr. Gormley: I will address the Minister through the Chair.
Mr. D. Ahern: I will, provided I am not interrupted when I speak.
Mr. Gormley: The Minister has not answered the question I put to him. I refer to the infrastructure Bill which is about the fast-tracking of major infrastructural projects.
Mr. D. Ahern: With due respect, that issue is not pertinent to the debate we are having.
Mr. Gormley: That is incorrect.
Mr. D. Ahern: I ask the Chair to ask the Deputy to keep to the topic to which we are referring.
Mr. Gormley: That is incorrect.
Mr. D. Ahern: There is no mention at all of nuclear energy.
Mr. Gormley: Hold on. With respect - you should sit down. I am in possession. The Minister is completely out of order. This was not a point of order. He did not even ask to make a point or order. It is pertinent and refers to the energy debate in this country. The Minister has left the option open to build a nuclear power station here. Will the Minister table an amendment that will exclude nuclear power? If the Minister is opposed to nuclear power and stands on his record, as he says he does, will he table this amendment? If he will not, my party and I will do everything we can to ensure that this is exposed. It is an important issue and ties significantly into the energy debate.
Mr. D. Ahern: I will categorically say that the Government is against nuclear power. Twisting it in any way would be incorrect. We will not allow nuclear power to be used in this country.
Mr. Gormley: Will the Minister table the amendment?
Mr. D. Ahern: I can assure the Deputy that that is the case. The Deputy referred to Guantanamo Bay. We raised the matter and were one of a number of countries that exhorted the Presidency to issue a statement on the continuation and hopeful closure of Guantanamo Bay.
Mr. Gormley: The document only names the Netherlands and Belgium. We did not get a mention.
Acting Chairman (Dr. Cowley): Other Deputies are waiting to ask questions.
Mr. D. Ahern: The fact that we did not get a mention does not mean we did not say anything. It goes back to what Deputy Quinn, with whom I agree, said on the transparency of these meetings.